Last Night's Presidential Debate

[black4rob2]

Any thoughts about last night's debate in which Affirmative Action was mention for the first time (even though for about 15 seconds).

How does that play into the problems of minority employment across the country and especially cities like Newark?

How will affect it the Newark Arena and how the award jobs to people? Sometimes in discussions about The Lovely City of Newark; it gets forgotten that there also exist a significant White population among us.

Also to keep into consideration, when speaking of Affirmative Action, is the education issue and its affect on the many minorities who attend or have hopes of attending one of the many institutions we have in NJ and in Newark.

[JoefromPGH]

Rob, I'm glad you brought the debate up.

Here's my two cents:

Bush looked very presidential (LOL). He completely skirted both the Affirmative Action issue (at least four years ago he gave some double talk) and the Rowe v Wade question. We all know Bush is totally against both and he pretty much admited it by saying virtuAlly nothing. Kerry on the other hand impressed me with his openness on Affirmative Action and also made it clear that it wasn't only geared to help minorities but also to help women.

Overall Kerry addressed the issues clearly* and satisfied both the moderate and liberal voters, I'm sure.

* I wish Kerry would be more clear on his "plans." He has more plans than anyone I've ever seen. I guess I need to spend some time on his website because if there are plans, that would be the place where those plans are spelled out.

As to Bush, his plans are simple...HE HAS NO PLANS!

[JoefromPGH]

Originally Posted by black4rob2

Any thoughts about last night's debate in which Affirmative Action was mention for the first time (even though for about 15 seconds).

How does that play into the problems of minority employment across the country and especially cities like Newark?

How will affect it the Newark Arena and how the award jobs to people? Sometimes in discussions about The Lovely City of Newark; it gets forgotten that there also exist a significant White population among us.

Also to keep into consideration, when speaking of Affirmative Action, is the education issue and its affect on the many minorities who attend or have hopes of attending one of the many institutions we have in NJ and in Newark.

Just a couple of more thoughts, directed at your questions.

I think, no, I'm sure, if Kerry is elected there will be, at a minimum, no downside changes to Affirmative Action. Bush has done everything to defeat
the initiative and four more years of Bush and his redneck congress could spell the end of Affirmative Action. Quite clearly, this is a big and important issue, along with the gradual lifting of the minimum wage to over $7/hour.

So as to your thoughts...as long as Kerry is elected and hopefully the Democrats can gain a few seats in the House during the next couple of years, the education and employment of minorities can only improve. As Kerry said "we still need Affirmative Action." That pretty much says it all. Frankly, I believe Kerry will be more receptive to those who are disadvataged than even Clinton was. I still cannot forget how Mr Politician (Clinton) took credit for that horrundous welfare reform bill several years ago. Pity the poor women living in the rural south who have to bus ride 3-4 hours to/from a job paying $5.50 an hour, while their children are home "taking care" of themselves....thank you Bill (and Knute).

Originally Posted by JoefromPGH

Bush has done everything to defeat
the initiative and four more years of Bush and his redneck congress could spell the end of Affirmative Action.

But the Supreme Court. There will be vacancies during the next 4 years. A couple of the justices are ready to retire now, including the chief justice. This will affect the court for the next generation.

I think the only reason that the the chief justice and O'Connor have not yet retired is that they don't want it to be said that they put a Republican in office just so that they could be insured of being replaced by another conservative. I think they are waiting for a duly elected president so that they can retire with a clear conscience.

[jazzyken]

What are your views on Kerry bringing up Cheney's daughter. Quite frankly everyone is out of whack for what??? Kerry did not bring the girl into the political race at all until Cheney tried to get the Lesbain votes. Once you open the can...

I believe if we do not get Bush out of office it will be a true "Vote or Die" issue. As a black woman with a family not a billionaire, I have no other alternative but to make sure we get that man out of office.

A co-worker said to me that if Kerry gets in we will be doomed. She really has no clue. Bush has "screwed" us for four years with no vaseline. And it is really starting to burn my as* right now.

[ProSouth]

You are right Jazzy, Cheney brought his lesbian daughter into the election. She's fair and open game. It definately was not dirty politics like Bush and Co. have been playing. Frankly I don't think Kerry went far enough. I think he should have brought up the obvious difference of opinion/policy between Bush and Cheney on gay issues in America.

[jazzyken]

Your right about that...
Cheney wants the lesbian votes for his daughter's sake while Bush wants to outlaw "Gay Marriages". Go figure they are running together. If they can not see eye 2 eye on this issue, imagine what they are debating behind closed doors .

[black4rob2]

at the same time he still has to play that political game with the undecided voters. By attacking George/Dick on that issue, he may come across as being insensitive and vindictive. He may come out as the guy who is willing to win at all costs, and sympathethics would not take to kindly of that strategy.

To be perfectly honest with you, I believe that he is making the right decision by not attacking, rather he is complimenting Cheney on his daughter. Everyone knows that he is against gay marriages, and I think that pressing the issue with Bush and Co, would only live him open for a blow to an impressive series of debate by his camp.

Since we are on the gay issue; the point that needs to be made is how do we punish those who commit acts of violence or hate towards gays and other minorities. This comes to mind when I reflect on the 15 year old girl who was murdered on Broad and Market a couple of years ago. How do we prevent those types of incidents from repeating. Between the two candidates, i believe Kerry was the only one who mentioned that we have to become more accepting of Gays and Lesbians in our societies and create a more equal playing field similiar to African Americans, similiar to Women, similar to all.

Originally Posted by black4rob2

How do we prevent those types of incidents from repeating. Between the two candidates, i believe Kerry was the only one who mentioned that we have to become more accepting of Gays and Lesbians in our societies and create a more equal playing field similiar to African Americans, similiar to Women, similar to all.

Many African American preachers are against likening the civil rights movement of gays and lesbians to the civil rights movement of African Americans. The similarities are there but people don't want to be associated with the gay civil rights movement. Before the 60s most people didn't want to be associated with the black civil rights movement either.

I think Kerry said the right thing about homosexuality not being a choice. Who would choose to go through life fearing for their very lives? In the larger cities, there is some tolerance for being different but go out into the rural nooks and cranies of this country and if someone found out that you were gay you'd be dead. Too bad you can't ask Matthew Shepard about his coming out experience in Wyoming.

Bush said he didn't know if homosexuality was a choice or not. What the hell is he trying to ammend the constitution for then? If homosexuality is not a choice (and it is not), then discriminating against gays and lesbians is worse than discriminating against Catholics and Baptists. You can chose to be a Catholic or Baptist where you cannot choose to be gay or lesbian.

One other thing about mentioning Mary Cheney - it did highlight the fact that the president and vice-president disagree on whether the constitution should be amended. Cheney says it should be left to the states.

Maybe Dick and Lynne think that Mary chooses to be a lesbian. That doesn't say much for her upbringing now does it? I mean if all the teachings of Dick and Lynne Cheney lead their daughter to choose to be a lesbian, then how can we trust Dick in the event that he needs to lead the country?